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12. Misogynist "A prostitute is a murder victim waiting to happen."

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Old February 20th, 2010, 06:58 PM   #1
JTRSickert
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Default Is JTR a true misogynist or just a prostitute-hater?

Hi everyone.

What is everyone's opinion of Jack's attitudes about women in general? Do we assume he hated all women (not just the pros) and used the street-walkers to vent this general rage? Or, was he capable of being a gentleman with other ladies and was able to have relationships with them...while he indulged in a bloodlust for prostitutes?
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Old February 20th, 2010, 07:18 PM   #2
Howard Brown
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The best one can do is probably guess, JT.
He could have been a mama's boy or a man with a serious dislike of his mom.
He may have been as courteous as the next chap or a rude bastard to women in general.
He might have been very shy in front of women when sober ( assuming he bent the elbow) or a real schmutz when he drank and became belligerent.

I'd think he disliked prosses...and the only way of knowing whether he targeted them intentionally would be for us to know whether he tried to subdue women who weren't prosses.

Colin Roberts posited the idea that he took those women down while they may have been panhandling.

Hopefully some others will respond.
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Old February 20th, 2010, 08:00 PM   #3
Adam Went
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Hi JT,

Good question. Personally I'm of the opinion that he was a bit of a womanizer, somebody who could make women feel comfortable around him, while underneath he had a seething anger. I don't necessarily think he just hated women as a whole, more likely that he gained some twisted pleasure out of seeing the pain and suffering of others.

We have a small glimpse at him through the witness statements, and almost invariably we have him standing with a woman, having a quiet conversation, seemingly quite friendly - Lawende said Kate had her hand on him, Hutchinson said Kelly laughed and he put his arm around her. So I would suggest he definitely had the ability to ingratiate himself with women.

It could have been that as a young man he was burned by a woman he loved a lot. Or that something bad happened to him as a young boy which was caused by a woman. It's all possible, but most likely, IMO, that he was just a card short of a deck, and enjoyed watching others suffer at his hands.

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Old February 20th, 2010, 08:10 PM   #4
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So I would suggest he definitely had the ability to ingratiate himself with women. -AW

When necessary. He seems to have been able to put the mask on when needed but was it always a necessity ?

I'd still consider the possibility that Nichols was assaulted without all the fuzzy prelude to alleyway coitus.
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Old February 20th, 2010, 08:31 PM   #5
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Well....and I didn't want to mention him on another thread, but for the sake of the argument, here goes....look at George Chapman. An evil, evil man, capable of anything and who enjoyed making people suffer at his hands. Watched women who he supposedly loved die slowly and painfully from the poison he was administering to them. Yet, at the same time, he was such a womanizer that he had numerous wives and mistresses, and even managed to convince 3 of them to "marry" him in false ceremonies, just so he could avail himself of any assets that his "wife's" family might have had.

Now Chapman is my suspect, but even if it wasn't him, I think this is the sort of bloke we are looking for as JTR. Somebody who would slip under the radar of the women he associated with, who didn't see his true colours until after they were too far involved with him. As you say How, somebody who could "put the mask on".

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Old February 20th, 2010, 09:39 PM   #6
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Surely if he had been a mere murdering and mutilating misogynist, at least one victim would have been a definite non-prostitute. Lots of women of all stripes to choose from at the time.
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Old February 20th, 2010, 09:48 PM   #7
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Surely if he had been a mere murdering and mutilating misogynist, at least one victim would have been a definite non-prostitute. Lots of women of all stripes to choose from at the time.

Not necessarily at that time of night & unaccompanied,Tim.
Some misogynistic women-killers avoided prosses altogether...like Bundy...although I am not comparing the Ripper to Bundy....only a comparison of those types of victims who were murdered by either man.

He could very well have felt that the perception of prosses was what it was and actually been surprised at the extra effort the Met police put into the manhunt....and reveled in their efforts.

I know that I certainly do.
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Old February 20th, 2010, 10:17 PM   #8
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Sounds to me like an area wanting research. Solitary women may not have been out in the wee hours in the West End, but all bets were off for the East End. Too many widows, divorcees, or abandoned women in hard economic times, without government relief, for them to be so discreet. For example, what about the poor homeless women who had no doss money, like that old woman we see in the 'Crawlers' photograph? Surely barmaids worked the pubs until closing (2 AM?) and then had to walk home alone. Businesses that opened early in the AM surely had help arrive some time before that. I should imagine that there really must have been a fair number of solitary women in the East End out and about at all hours of the night for one reason or another. Saturday search, sir?
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Old February 20th, 2010, 11:07 PM   #9
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Saturday Search it is Tim, but I'll make a Sunday Search tomorrow on that very subject...

The way you present your argument does seem to insinuate that homeless women,prosses, and even those found dead on doorsteps ( I have put up a few of those on Saturday Searches before ) were equally available for the murderers . I see your point.

Does this indicate to anyone else that prosses were targeted ?

What I'll do Tim...is look up cases where women were found murdered on the street prior to 1888 and try and ascertain whether any of them were not prostitutes at that point in their lives.

I suppose a counter or alternative argument might be that there was little differentiation between a "homeless" Nichols ( which she may have been at the time but on her own volition since she had been allegedly offered a roof over her head) and a "prossing" Nichols.

Chapman as well.

I'll get on it in the A.M. Tim.
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Old February 21st, 2010, 09:43 AM   #10
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Tim:

I'll post all the murders I can locate here on JT's thread...which involve Ripper like crimes ( mutilation & evisceration) and the sector of society the women murdered came from.

In 1837, we find the murder of Hannah Brown, mutilated and left without head,thighs or legs...the Edgeware Road murder. She wasn't a prostitute.

THE EDGEWARE ROAD MURDER, AND CONFESSION OF THE MURDERER .
The Champion and Weekly Herald
(London, England)
Sunday, April 2, 1837

http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/a...iving/erm1.jpg
http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/a...iving/erm2.jpg
http://i908.photobucket.com/albums/a...iving/erm3.jpg
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