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Mysteries Within The Mystery Forum for researchers to list what they feel are the most uncanny mysteries within the greater mystery....the identity and motive of the Whitechapel Murderer

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Old Today, 10:24 AM   #251
Mr. Poster
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Ecchymosis+neck+strangulation are words of aquaintance to each other.

Im not saying she was strangled to death...but there is evidence something was round her neck with pressure on the front.

P
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"Chance hasn't yet peached on Jack the Ripper.If she ever does, it will probably be cause for grotesque disappointment among the Ripperologists, who get as much joy from attacking one another's lunacies, as from any problems originally posed by the Whitechapel murderer" R. Gowers, The Independant, Saturday, 31 December 1994
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Old Today, 11:03 AM   #252
Jon Simons
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Ecchymosis+neck+strangulation are words of aquaintance to each other.

Im not saying she was strangled to death...but there is evidence something was round her neck with pressure on the front.

P

Yes, I agree that there appears to be interference with the breathing, but in both cases, cause of death is given as severance of the carotid artery.
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Old Today, 11:16 AM   #253
Jon Simons
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I cannot find where its said kellys was just one cut?. It was cut all round. That doesnt mean just one cut?

Yes, I think it does.
If there were numerous cuts to the neck, the doctor would have noted it.
Indeed, in Bond`s notes on Kelly he describes other wounds as several jagged wounds, cut by several incisions, and several abrasions.


Phillips could not even say which severed carotid artery was the cause of death, I assume, because there was no obvious starting point to the cut.
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Old Today, 11:26 AM   #254
Trevor Marriott
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Trevor,

Now, I won't go through the problems with Reid all over again, and the noise of the readers sighing with relief at that is deafening,

You dont have to just admit you are wrong

But I'll just point out to you - yet again - that being a primary source doesn't mean it is necessarily correct. So, it isn't two faced to question the accuracy of a primary source. But take a look at what that primary source actually says:

Well every time in the past I have pointed out that newspapers are generally secondary sources you tell me they are not, I call that now being two faced !

"I ought to tell you that the stories of portions of the body having been taken away by the murderer were all untrue. In every instance the body was complete. The mania of the murderer was exclusively for horrible mutilation. The landlord was brought round to the house by his man, and the sight of the poor mutilated woman turned his brain"

Two things. The minor one is that there is no evidence that McCarthy's brain was turned by the sight of Mary Kelly.

What does Reid mean by that? I would suggest McCarhty was visibly shocked as were all the others who entered Millers Court and that what he meant by that statement

The other is that when Reid wrote 'in every instance', he wasn't saying that every bit of Kelly was accounted for, he was talking about all the victims. And in case anyone doubts that's what he meant, he went on to say 'The mania of the murderer was exclusively for horrible mutilation'.

You are wrong again, Reid was specifically talking about the Kelly murder. If you read the whole interview you will see that he discusses all the other murders individually, and that specific reference was in relation to the Kelly murder

Reid is a valuable source, but flawed. Add to that Dr. Bond's statement that the heart was 'absent', Dr. Hebbert's specific statement that the heart was not found, the search of the ashes of Kelly's fire by the doctors, and the long-lasting speculation in the press that the heart was missing, and Reid's authority and reliability diminishes considerably. You can cling on to Reid of course, and I'm sure you will.

Bonds statement is ambiguous, and Hebbert did not go back to the crime scene with the other doctors and Reid, so what he writes in unsafe to believe in the light of what Reids says, and what the papers said, that nothing was missing from the body. Reids interview is the jewel in the crown and it is a pleasure to see you squirming and trying to prove him wrong.

So do your old, cracked record bit, Trevor. Claim I have some sort of reputation to preserve, that I want to keep selling books (selling books would be nice), that I want to preserve the status quo. Somebody, somewhere might be silly enough to believe you. Meanwhile, I genuinely apologise to everyone here. I really shouldn't contribute to the Forums, especially when Trevor's about.
No you should not contribute because you have nothing new to contribute on these matters if anyone is acting like a cracked record its not me, so it must be you, and I have nothing more to say on the topic.

Jack the Ripper R.I.P.


www.trevormarriott.co.uk
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Old Today, 11:27 AM   #255
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Yes, I agree that there appears to be interference with the breathing, but in both cases, cause of death is given as severance of the carotid artery.
True Jon. But thrittling is a lovers thing. Maybe Joe throttled her to unconciousness, thought he killed her and just decided he would make it a ripper thing.

I dont agree on the point re one cut or two.

P
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"Chance hasn't yet peached on Jack the Ripper.If she ever does, it will probably be cause for grotesque disappointment among the Ripperologists, who get as much joy from attacking one another's lunacies, as from any problems originally posed by the Whitechapel murderer" R. Gowers, The Independant, Saturday, 31 December 1994
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Old Today, 11:40 AM   #256
Jon Simons
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True Jon. But thrittling is a lovers thing. Maybe Joe throttled her to unconciousness, thought he killed her and just decided he would make it a ripper thing.


Okay, so you believe Kelly was killed by Barnett, and I believe Kelly and Chapman were killed by the same hand, so, why can`t Joe be Jack the Ripper ? :-)
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