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The Witnesses + Evidence Inquest testimonies and how they have influenced Ripperology...from Albert Cadosch to a cry of "Oh,Murder !"....from the Goulston Street Graffito to those letters from Hell.

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Old July 22nd, 2017, 02:07 PM   #541
Michael Banks
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Point of Trivia:
Petticoat Lane ceased to exist by 1846, it is said to have been due to Victorian prudishness, in choosing to avoid any public reference to undergarments....But they decided on renaming it MiddleSEX street?
Are you Stephen Fry?

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Michael
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Old July 29th, 2017, 02:48 PM   #542
Sean Crundall
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Hi Wicker Man,

Well spotted! Northern instead of western is an error. It's nice to see that somebody's on the ball!

Allow me time to fully digest, and comment, on your Goulston St. argument.

Best wishes,

Sean.
Hi Wicker Man,

Apologies for the much delayed response!

I agree, PC Long would have begun his beat at 10 pm. This beat was, as Neil suggests in Capturing Jack the Ripper, the "night relief" The hours which governed this beat were 10 pm to 6 am. The portion of apron was discovered by PC Long at 2.55 am. And so, if we accept the timing of a 30 mins beat (which is likely) then PC Long would have been nearing the end of his beat when he discovered the piece of apron.

I've checked my copies of the Police Code for 1889 and 1890, which state: Beats - 2. "The method of working beats must be frequently changed..."

It was also the constable's duty to see "that doors, windows, gratings, cellar-flaps, fan-lights, and places through which a thief might enter, or obtain access, are not left open".

If PC Long was adhering to the strictures of Vincent's Police Code (providing the 1881 and 1889 Codes' tally) he would have checked Wentworth Model Dwellings and would (at the very least) have checked the door leading to the cellar. Had the portion of apron been there at 2.20 am he couldn't have failed to have noticed it.

I know it's unfair (given we know little of his true moral character) to cast aspersions on PC Long's testimony but we just don't know how diligent he was in executing his duties that morning.

My best wishes,

Sean.
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Old July 29th, 2017, 04:40 PM   #543
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Hi Wicker Man,

Apologies for the much delayed response!

I agree, PC Long would have begun his beat at 10 pm. This beat was, as Neil suggests in Capturing Jack the Ripper, the "night relief" The hours which governed this beat were 10 pm to 6 am. The portion of apron was discovered by PC Long at 2.55 am. And so, if we accept the timing of a 30 mins beat (which is likely) then PC Long would have been nearing the end of his beat when he discovered the piece of apron.

I've checked my copies of the Police Code for 1889 and 1890, which state: Beats - 2. "The method of working beats must be frequently changed..."

It was also a constable's duty to see "that doors, windows, gratings, cellar-flaps, fan-lights, and places through which a thief might enter, or obtain access, are not left open".

If PC Long was adhering to the strictures of Vincent's Police Code (providing the 1881 and 1889 Codes' tally) he would have checked Wentworth Model Dwellings and would (at the very least) have checked the door leading to the cellar. Had the portion of apron been there at 2.20 am he couldn't have failed to have noticed it.

I know it's unfair (given we know little of his true moral character) to cast aspersions on PC Long's testimony but we just don't know how diligent he was in executing his duties that morning.

My best wishes,

Sean.
Hi Sean, just recently we have been talking about Castle Alley, do you recall the testimony of P.C. Andrews that night...... " I then proceeded up Castle-alley, and tried the doors on the west side of the alley."

Just like P.C. Long, that was their job as expressed in the Police Code.If Long was doing what he was supposed to do there was no way he could have missed that piece of apron on his rounds.
I'm inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt as we have no cause to do otherwise.
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"
The theory that the murderer is a lunatic is dispelled by the opinion given to the police by an expert in the treatment of lunacy patients......."If he's insane
" observed the medical authority, "he's a good deal sharper than those who are not".
Reynolds Newspaper, 4 Nov. 1888.
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Old July 29th, 2017, 05:24 PM   #544
Sean Crundall
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Hi Sean, just recently we have been talking about Castle Alley, do you recall the testimony of P.C. Andrews that night...... " I then proceeded up Castle-alley, and tried the doors on the west side of the alley."

Just like P.C. Long, that was their job as expressed in the Police Code.If Long was doing what he was supposed to do there was no way he could have missed that piece of apron on his rounds.
I'm inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt as we have no cause to do otherwise.
Hi Wicker Man,

I'll check out the Castle Alley post. Thanks!

What disturbs me about the 1880's police is the prevalence of alcoholism, especially among constables. It's an unpalatable topic but it must be objectively addressed.

Prior to joining the police PC Long was a military man who earned a Good Conduct Medal in 1880. And yet, in 1889, he was dismissed "for being drunk on duty".

I've known ex military men who spent their time fighting (often among themselves) and drinking, and yet received excellent references.

Best wishes,

Sean.
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